Immunity Sought by President for Poindexter, North

WASHINGTON â€”  President Reagan, proclaiming “an urgent need for full disclosure of all facts surrounding the Iranian controversy,â€� asked the Senate Intelligence Committee Tuesday to seek limited immunity from prosecution for Adm. John M. Poindexter and Lt. Col. Oliver L. North.

Reagan’s move, which the President described as an effort to encourage his two former aides to tell “the whole truth,� was immediately and sharply criticized by senior members of the Intelligence Committee.

Those members said that a majority of the panel opposes granting even limited immunity at this time to the two men, who have refused to testify before congressional panels three times in two weeks about the secret sale of U.S. arms to Iran and the diversion of profits from those sales to Nicaragua’s rebels.

‘Unanswered Question’

“At this point in time, the No. 1 unanswered question is how high up the chain of command that the knowledge and participation and the diversion of funds went,� incoming Senate Intelligence Committee Chairman David L. Boren (D-Okla.) said. “To grant immunity might, ironically, result in immunity from prosecution to those who have inflicted very serious damage to the country. That’s the reason we should be very, very careful.�

Although the senators said that they would consider Reagan’s request, they insisted that they would make no decision until an independent counsel is chosen to investigate the case and a new select Senate committee can begin its work.

In addition, a wide range of attorneys with extensive experience as prosecutors said that they believe the request, if granted, would make prosecution much more difficult.

But Sen. Richard G. Lugar (R-Ind.) argued: “The whole story can be in front of us by Christmas, and the story is more important than the prosecution.�

Under a 16-year-old law, witnesses who are given limited immunity--or “use immunity,� in legal terminology--can be compelled to testify, but their testimony may not then be used against them in criminal prosecutions. As a result, they cannot cite the Fifth Amendment right to remain silent on grounds of possible self-incrimination.

Not Seeking Immunity

But, even should Poindexter, the former national security adviser to Reagan, and North, a Marine aide on the National Security Council staff, be granted immunity, it is uncertain how they would respond. Attorneys for the two men did not return calls Tuesday, but, in earlier appearances before the House Foreign Affairs Committee, they said that their clients were not seeking immunity.

At the White House, spokesman Larry Speakes said he was unaware of any assurances that, given immunity, the pair would in fact testify. If they refused to testify after being granted immunity, they could be cited for contempt of Congress.

Reagan presented the request in terms of his desire to bring out details of the operation, under which money paid by Iran for U.S. weapons was funneled to Swiss bank accounts intended to assist Nicaragua’s contras. But others, including a former senior aide, characterized the move as an effort to ease the political pressure building on the White House.

In a written statement read by Speakes at a hastily called briefing, Reagan said: “It is my desire to have the full story about Iran come out now--the alleged transfer of funds, the Swiss bank accounts, who was involved--everything.�

But, among the senators involved in the investigation, there was widespread skepticism about the President’s proposal.

Sen. Dave Durenberger (R-Minn.), the current chairman, said that the intelligence panel already has had “spirited discussions� about immunity and will discuss it again today.

“But there has not been an effort on the part of a majority of the members of this committee to move in the direction of immunity,� he said.

So far, Sen. Orrin G. Hatch (R-Utah) has been the strongest supporter of immunity on the committee.

National Interest Cited

“There’s still a lot of information that would be very helpful to us if North and Poindexter could testify,� said Hatch, who will serve on the new select committee. “The interest of the presidency, the interest of our foreign policy, the interest of the nation far outweigh any argument against giving immunity at this point.�

Before Tuesday, as the controversy over the Iran-contra link unfolded, Reagan and his aides had urged Poindexter and North to testify freely, while at the same time acknowledging the pair’s right to silence.

Atty. Gen. Edwin Meese III has said that North, who was relieved of his duties on Nov. 25, was the only Administration official with “precise� knowledge of the Iran-contra operation. Both he and Poindexter, who resigned on the day North was fired, have cited the Fifth Amendment in refusing to answer the questions of three Senate and House committees.

One former senior adviser to Reagan predicted that the initial response “by the American public� would be to see the proposal as an effort “to get to the bottom and put out all the information.�

Putting Onus on Congress

But the former official, speaking on the condition that he not be identified, warned: “Rapidly, it will be interpreted as the President’s attempt to put the onus on Congress.�

Then, he said, “it will be viewed within a matter of days as a public relations move by the White House, in part because they had no assurance from the congressional leadership that this unusual request would be granted.�

This former official said: “I think it is of marginal value. I don’t think it will reduce the heat. The questions will still remain: Who is in charge of the White House and who has been running the White House for the last two years and why can’t the White House get to the bottom of it itself?�

Speakes said that Reagan discussed the step with Meese, White House counsel Peter Wallison, Senate Republican leader Bob Dole of Kansas and others before making the decision.

Judges Must Decide

In seeking approval of a grant of immunity, the congressional committee would have to apply to a panel of U.S. District Court judges in Washington. The actual grant would have to be approved by a two-thirds majority of the committee.

However, if the panel does seek to grant immunity to North, Poindexter or other witnesses, the Justice Department or the independent counsel being appointed in the probe would have up to 30 days to oppose the step while developing evidence for prosecution.

In his statement, Reagan said: “Such ‘use immunity’ is not amnesty or clemency. This legal process obtains the facts before Congress but does not prevent those responsible for any wrongdoing from being brought to justice. Thus, it does not interfere with the duties and responsibilities of the independent counsel.�

An independent counsel, formerly known as a special prosecutor, is expected to be named by a committee of U.S. appeals court judges by the end of the week.

Wants Facts Presented

Speakes, questioned about the impact that immunity could have on the independent counsel’s work, replied:

“It is the President’s desire that any people who are responsible for wrongdoing in this affair be prosecuted. But the President’s overriding reason is that the facts (must) be presented to the American people as quickly as possible and that we get on with the business of government now.�

Speakes denied that the granting of immunity would make the work of a prosecutor more difficult.

“It does not prevent an independent counsel . . . from pursuing matters outside of the congressional testimony or matters that they may have been able to pursue up until the point that the immunity is granted,� he said.